tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9071757402186489670.post3533619416110648920..comments2023-03-25T21:50:50.891+13:00Comments on Bavardess: Torture museums and public historyBavardesshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10737120234578385755noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9071757402186489670.post-50387790021513217082009-11-08T19:34:23.372+13:002009-11-08T19:34:23.372+13:00B: Oh, yes! I was petrified by the hall of freaks...B: Oh, yes! I was petrified by the hall of freaks! And by the torture display, too. That whole museum gave me the creeps, actually. :)<br /><br />And Digger, love the coinage "edutainment"!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9071757402186489670.post-66656933987841511652009-11-08T18:13:54.747+13:002009-11-08T18:13:54.747+13:00Ink - I remember the Ripley's from a trip to F...Ink - I remember the Ripley's from a trip to Florida as a child. At that time, they still had the 'hall of freaks' (animal, human and faked up animal-human hybrids), which gave me nightmares for months afterwards.<br />Digger - yep, there is way too much money to be made here for people to treat it ethically and the fine line is getting ever finer all the time.Bavardesshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10737120234578385755noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9071757402186489670.post-66541990909080053782009-11-08T14:13:16.481+13:002009-11-08T14:13:16.481+13:00If you call it "history" or "educat...If you call it "history" or "educational" then it makes it ok to stare at the horrors! Plus, you can encourage schools to bring their students to places exactly like the Dungeon... there is lots of $$ in school tours, don't forget each large bus holds around 45 people! Plus, they come during the weekdays, when traffic from other sources is virtually nil. <br /><br />There's a fine line, I think, between edutainment, sucker-ism, and exploitation.Diggerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14851524413793098615noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9071757402186489670.post-51223016751729706752009-11-08T05:07:20.805+13:002009-11-08T05:07:20.805+13:00Oh wow. What an interesting museum! I was discuss...Oh wow. What an interesting museum! I was discussing the Iron Maiden in class yesterday and secretly remembering that where I'd learned about it was at the uber-cheesy Ripley's Believe It Or Not museum in San Francisco...Inkhttp://inktopia.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9071757402186489670.post-38534427313507446702009-11-07T11:46:50.219+13:002009-11-07T11:46:50.219+13:00Thanks for your thoughtful comments.
Gavin - I hav...Thanks for your thoughtful comments.<br />Gavin - I have problems with the 'remembrance industry' because remembrance seems to be getting tied more and more closely to a form of exclusionary nationalism that I find unsettling. In New Zealand and Australia, there has been a marked increase in the number of young people attending ANZAC dawn commemorations. The media generally reports this as a positive sign that 'kids are learning to respect their elders', but I think it may be just as much about trying to re-establish the boundaries between 'us' and 'them' in the face of globalisation and an increasingly multicultural society.<br /><br />The London Dungeon wouldn't bother me so much if it was billed as pure entertainment - that really wouldn't make it any different from horror movies or video games. It's the pretense it makes to being educational, and even to having a role in the school environment, that gives me pause. You're right about the temptation to whiggish smugness, though. Perhaps an exhibition that includes both the ducking stool and waterboarding would be instructive?<br /><br />Tenth - that post sounds interesting. I find bone chapels macabre but at the same time quite beautiful, because human bones themselves are very sculptural. The chapels (and those late medieval transi tombs, which I love) also confront us in a very visceral and immediate way with the reality of death and our own mortality, which is something many of us in westernised societies try so hard to avoid in our day-to-day lives. But as you say, there are big cultural differences at work here. For example, I think I'd be intrigued rather than disgusted by the Body Worlds exhibition, but I'm sure that's at least partly to do with the fact that I attach no religious or spiritual value to a dead body. Where people do attach such a value to bodies or body parts, I believe that needs to be respected but it's interesting to see how that gets negotiated when it conflicts with the perceived interests of science (or indeed, of 'progress' and development. But watching the film 'Poltergeist' was enough to convince me you shouldn't go around digging up old Native American burial grounds!)Bavardesshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10737120234578385755noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9071757402186489670.post-21146043084218504022009-11-06T01:14:35.446+13:002009-11-06T01:14:35.446+13:00There is a big cultural difference here too. I hav...There is a big cultural difference here too. I have a post brewing that compares Czech bone chapels (which are way off my personal comfort radar) with the furore in the USA over native American graves and also with the trouble over where the bodies for Gunther Hagens's Bodyworlds exhibitions came from; this seems very germane and I'll link it in. The edges of the taboo on death and horror are unfortunately profitable (though they'll never beat the profit margin of the taboo on sex).Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9071757402186489670.post-506451756247114392009-11-05T21:37:25.443+13:002009-11-05T21:37:25.443+13:00It's interesting to think about how old histor...It's interesting to think about how old history has to get before people stop taking it seriously and either ignore it or see it as a source of entertainment. I've been thinking about war and remembrance (not the bad mini-series!) because of the time of year and blog posts about "poppy fascism". Why is it that we have to respect those who saved us from Hitler and Wilhelm II, but not those who saved us from Napoleon, Louis XIV or Philip II? I don't think it's necessarily a linear thing which declines over time, because some people in Britian seem to be getting <i>more</i> sanctimonious about the First World War.<br /><br />With torture as titillation, I think that getting history presented more seriously is only half the battle because the meanings that people find in museums will still be influenced by their own prejudices and by wider culture. If the London Dungeon became as solemn and moving as a Holocaust museum it might just lead to a smug sense of superiority about how far we've "progressed". What might be really effective is a display which juxtaposed early-modern horrors like the scold's bridle with examples of how women's speech, conduct and appearance are <i>still</i> regulated by society today. But conservatives would say that was "biased" and "anachronistic".Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9071757402186489670.post-45974683314824362072009-11-05T03:39:34.192+13:002009-11-05T03:39:34.192+13:00I'm not sure whether I should find the picture...I'm not sure whether I should find the picture with the Museum of Medieval Torture Instruments sign directly above the McRib sandwich sign very funny or somewhat disturbing.RPS77https://www.blogger.com/profile/14698390366612218268noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9071757402186489670.post-62781080996067771712009-11-05T03:10:12.805+13:002009-11-05T03:10:12.805+13:00I hadn't really considered this properly. Than...I hadn't really considered this properly. Thanks for the post. I avoid grizzly museums and ghost tours etc I guess because I find myself not being able to engage with them. I just look at the artefacts and scan the text without actually attaching them to any story or schema in a meaningful way. I find myself terribly bored. I rush through and can't wait to get outside again. This post made me think about the experience in another way.Academic, Hopefulhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17474557296107830403noreply@blogger.com